Stock Fuel Rails, why they don’t keep up

[jonx96]

I feel like I'm close to the safe hp limit on mine at present. Depending on how things go I may eventually go drop in rods/pistons or 426(ish) and a Whipple if I wanna get silly.

And a trans it sounds like 😜

 

[Hpindy]

Is what it is, we live and learn and no one has a crystal ball, like I said I’m happy with the car, she runs strong, was better then just sticking with the stock cam as I would have then been wishing I did go with the Demon RE one. I think I’d need more blower for any more cam anyways at the moment. I’m stuffing her pretty hard already, seeing a PR over 2.5 in great air and aircharge approaching 2300 she’s breathing about at the limit of stock heads now too. So there’s more to just adding more cam to get bigger gains. I’m not up for that much work and money at the moment, this engine is too new yet to be tearing it apart again already and tossing out new parts, time to just drive it!! We’re good my friend, well, as soon as you get those dam rims down here!! (Just kidding, I don’t got tires for them yet anyways)

I think you are beyond the capabilities of the 2.4L.

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[16GoManGoHC2]

I think you are beyond the capabilities of the 2.4L.

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I agree!! It’s at it limit no doubt. If it were not for the chiller it probably would not be worth spinning it as fast as it is because it does make a lot of heat, The chiller is definitely helping there keeping IAT’s under control

 

[Hpindy]

I agree!! It’s at it limit no doubt. If it were not for the chiller it probably would not be worth spinning it as fast as it is because it does make a lot of heat, The chiller is definitely helping there keeping IAT’s under control

Agreed ! ..

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[Hpindy]

On a side note about cams .. with my new cam the car is more responsive on the street and I get the exact same MPG.. i can still go 400 miles on a tank( all hwy) .. Exactly same as with the demon cam .

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[16GoManGoHC2]

I feel like I'm close to the safe hp limit on mine at present. Depending on how things go I may eventually go drop in rods/pistons or 426(ish) and a Whipple if I wanna get silly.

I dont think drop ins are going to be that much stronger then the RE rods and pistons to warrant the work and cost. To be drop in they have to weigh the same, which means H beam rods are not that beefy enough to really be much stronger then the stock Demon/RE rods are. If I were to do my build again, and I was starting with a low miles RE block and the stock size bores where perfect and useable especially being that the RE block is tq plate honed with 2 TQ plates in place and is perfectly and evenly stressing the block producing holes rounder then most shops can ever hope to get them. I would reuse the stock pistons and rings keeping them matched to the grooves and holes the came out of and they’ll reseat just as good as when they ran last. weigh them with rings and pins, check/open up ring gap to .024 on top .026” on second, leave oil control rings alone and spend your money (like 1500 bucks) on a good I beam rod sized for the stock .9434” (24mm) DLC PINS. Have the crank rebalanced for the rod weight difference, assemble it all with the same bearings it came apart with (assuming they look perfect) if not use King PMax Black coated tri metal bearings. Stud the mains and heads, maybe a bigger cam since it’s apart, add a +10 ati lower when it’s going back together and give it hell on E85. If you want to be able to go back to flex buy just a stock size ATI shell and swap lower shells and a shorter belt and load your flex tune back in. Changing ati lowers it’s a bolt on swap once the hub is pinned and fitted to the crank. I think the stock MAHLE Demon/RE M142 material pistons are the best piston to use for even 1100 wheel. They just are engineered so perfectly for longevity due to that damn good M142 material which is a blend of 2618 and 4032 aluminum which gives the best attributes of each material and allows a super tight piston to wall fit (remember the Demon/RE piston is fitted with about a.001” more clearance then a Hellcat fit which is still only around .0015 piston to wall clearance which is way to tight with 2618 aftermarket piston which equites around .005” but they’ll run quiet and smooth for 100,000 miles with their hard anodized ring lands and plasma coated rings and slippery material their made from. That M142 is some great stuff, I wish they would start making aftermarket pistons with the stuff. No piston slap, no piston rock, no piston scuffing, their perfectly engineered pistons, reuse them and spend your money on a great i beam rod and reuse the pistons and their rings that are already perfectly seated. DONT rescuff the cylinders with a ball hone or nothing, just oil them upon disassembly so they don’t rust and clean them well with a lint free cloth when going back together and that’s it. Maybe a MLX head gasket instead of the stock MLS design. And Rock!! The powder forged rod is the weak link not the piston, only issue with the pistons is ring gaps are too tight, open them up and they won’t get stuck at the top under increased boost and hot IAT’s. That’s what I would do with your RE engine and add a massaged 2.7 blower or being your rich (lol) a new Whipple just for their dual pass heat exchanger set up and their more efficient rotors which will probably be s 50 hp gain just from less power to run the blower.

 

[16GoManGoHC2]

Well it’s been a long while since a post here, cars been down since about the end of May as I removed the axles to return them for inspection because the had a vibration in them at high speed especially if unloaded after a 1/4 or even worse a 1/2 mile coast out from 180(by unloaded meaning push the clutch in and coast or kick it into neutral and let it coast out bleeding speed) When I installed the Axles last year they had a very visible wobble to them. After running them and feeling the vibration I removed them and measured the stubs and found them to be around .002” smaller in diameter then stock and RE axles I had.

So GForce told me to send them in for inspection so I removed them before going on vacation for 2 weeks with the hope of having them back soon after I got back home. GForce found the stubs to be on the edge of the lower acceptable tolerance limit and replaced them under warranty, only problem was they weren’t in stock and I had to wait on them, was a long wait!! But was worth it as I was greeted with a set of brand new axles when I opened the box


I measured them for comparison to what was sent in and stock and found measurements showed them to be about .001” bigger then stock and about .003” bigger then the first set. They still slid right in without issue but this set no wobble . A test run to 140 and back yesterday was vibration free so the axles where definitely the culprit.

 

[16GoManGoHC2]

In installing the axles I tried a new technique that @jonx96 suggested to me to try, using a bolt and nuts to push the bushing in the lower knuckle in out of the way instead of the crude didn’t seem right hammer and drift method I was using. MUCH easier and effective!!! 2 wrench turns on a nut pushed the bushing flush up against the spindle body allowing the spindle to drop right one the lower control arm and effortlessly align the holes to slide the bolt in place. So I figured I’d share the technique will all who have been keeping interest in the continued adventures of GoManGo lol.


I used a M14x2.0x 85 mm long socket head cap screw and used a die to fully thread the partially threaded grade 12.9 socket head cap screw, then added 2 nuts and a few washers.



Slide the bolt in in the same way the original comes out, add washers, 2 nuts, 2 more washers and thread them up the bolt until the bolt can align itself into the other hole in the spindle. Then with 2 M22 open end wrenches (or 2 adjustable wrenches), hold 1 nut in place, turn the other about 1 full turn and the bushing is pressed flat into te spindle totally out of the way!!


Sure took the biggest PITA part of the job out of the way. If any one wants to buy a bolt and not setup let me know I can make some up being threading the bolt requires a M14x2.0 die which many probably don’t have. $25 shipped, add $15 for each additional setup beyond 1, flat shipping rate fir as many that will fit in a USPS Small Flat Rate Box. PM me if you need one.

 

[jonx96]

Glad my suffering and findings could help you
Hardest part is fining the proper bolt to do this with. Most aren't threaded all the way at the local hardware.

To anyone who is going to say why didn't he drop the diff. Geforce Axles cannot be changed by dropping the diff!!!! They will break. Ask me how I know? I am getting faster and faster at doing axles. I have done them about 8 times in the last 8 months
Yes I have to pull my axles again. Uhhhhh Im going to try and put it off since ive already done it twice just this month.

 

[Speedy!]

Mike, where's your data on the billet bearing plate? I've tried searching for an hour and I give up.

 

[16GoManGoHC2]

Mike, where's your data on the billet bearing plate? I've tried searching for an hour and I give up.

what you looking for dyno graph of before plate and after plate?

 

[Speedy!]

Yes, I thought I remembered you testing it but can't find it now. 50rwhp sticks in my mind. Did you notice any reduction in IATs?

 

[16GoManGoHC2]

Yes, I thought I remembered you testing it but can't find it now. 50rwhp sticks in my mind. Did you notice any reduction in IATs?

Here ya go. Yes, a solid 50 hp. This on 93 with a can of Octanium per 15 gallons of fuel. 2.85 upper stock lower. What was added was the FAS billet plate, port matched snout to plate inlet and opened up inlet to match a Fastman modded 95mm TB




Little to no change in IAT but I run a chiller. Only increase in IAT I’ve seen is since I’ve added a +10 lower and stepped down to a 2.72 from a 2.85. The better breathing can be seen from 5500 rpm and up.

 

[16GoManGoHC2]

This weekend I’m hoping to dyno test a change from a BBK 100 TB to a HHP 105mm TB. Being that my aircharge is up allot now after adding the +10 lower and 2.72 upper might be restricted some by the 100mm valve. Hopefully we will see Saturday, HHP TB due to arrive tomorrow. I’m really anxious to measure the blade diameter and see if it’s a true 105 or not, the inlet and outlet taper seen in pictures makes me wonder. Stay tuned!!

 

[16GoManGoHC2]

Ok, the results are in, BBK100mm verse HHP105mm throttle body. Same snout which is opened up matched to the 100 mm TB outlet, ie with the 105 mounted there was a 2.5mm lip restriction all the way around the 105’s outlet. So what was the result? Did it make more or less HP? If more how much? if less how much? or the same little to no difference?? Dyno pulls done within 10 minutes of each other, IAT and critical temps pretty much matched. All was done is a baseline pull, swap in the HHP 105, do a throttle relearn, and hit it again. DA was around 4300, ya, pretty yucky. Sooooo what’s the opinions?? This ain’t for free no more 😂

But…….. The winner will get, wait for it, waaaiittt for it……..





TO BE CALLED THE WINNER!!!🥱

 

[DavidKFla]

Bad links

 

[BULL]

My guess, is that you saw a negligible increase at the top of the RPM range.

 

[16GoManGoHC2]

My guess, is that you saw a negligible increase at the top of the RPM range.

And nothing any where else either?

 

[16GoManGoHC2]

Bad links

Sorry, Was replacing pictures I put the wrong one and one was supposed to show the BBK mounted in the other the HHP mounted. Take a look again

 

[BULL]

And nothing any where else either?

Possibly a small decrease on the bottom end (velocity efficiency decrease) but I'll stick with my original statement.