Demon 170 1/4 times

[Bowtie Guy]

You don't remember the original Demon?? It was retarded.

Who would have seen this coming

 

[vortecd]

Draining windshield wiper fluid and/or removing reservoir
Removing windshield wipers and motor
Lightweight battery
Removing hardware from throughout the vehicle that would otherwise go unnoticed

The rules above don’t work, they assume that people will follow rules.
Weigh a 1 seat no option factory Demon 170 and set a weight requirement accordingly - also enforcing the rules above to keep the weight located largely where it was from the factory.

A target weight it where it is. There was a weight for the 18s also at some point. The weight needs to be a race weigh also

 

[vortecd]

Instead of making rules, why not let the people run their 170's and just list the mods done to them. NBD.

That is also an option but some people are not trust worthy for that. Laying out some rules for what is stock like they did is a good way to go but someone will always cheat

 

[oilburner]

the more admin. you paid the quicker the car should be.

 

[vortecd]

For myself I would be very interested in running against others that are stock. They should all run the same times you would think but could be some tricks in the launch.

When I ran a class in NMRA the people that were not the fastest would say the others were cheating. For myself I wasn't the fastest but knew I was legal. Combos in that were so different it was just finding the right combo that worked well together

Some people have to be on top no matter what while others can have fun doing it. I was never around when the Demons ran at the track but I still saw people saying others were cheating because of the times they ran

 

[Jack_Toepfer]

I don’t disagree with letting people do whatever the hell they want with their cars, I just don’t want them stealing the limelight from anyone who did it straight. That limelight matters to some, and they’ve earned it, and they entertain me. I want them to be successful.

 

[Marc W]

Legions has stated the two classes they will use to acknowledge times. The factory stock class allowing wheel/tire changes and interior deletes except for the factory drivers seat (because Dodge did for those promotional numbers). Nothing else. The lightweight class requiring stock engine computer and driveline but allowing light weight parts mods. Drivers seat, battery, bumper supports, etc. Think Rons car. I don’t think any performance claims outside to the Legions scrutiny can be deemed legit. Not that they might not be, but who’s to know. I do know Ron. I’ve talked to him personally a million times at the track and I have no doubt he will not cheat. He will do every little thing for advantage but he lives this shit and his performance is a result of his dedication to details that most don’t. One of the others on the stage right now will cheat like a mfkr. I know that because he has in the past.

 

[cole3986]

Legions has stated the two classes they will use to acknowledge times. The factory stock class allowing wheel/tire changes and interior deletes except for the factory drivers seat (because Dodge did for those promotional numbers). Nothing else. The lightweight class requiring stock engine computer and driveline but allowing light weight parts mods. Drivers seat, battery, bumper supports, etc. Think Rons car. I don’t think any performance claims outside to the Legions scrutiny can be deemed legit. Not that they might not be, but who’s to know. I do know Ron. I’ve talked to him personally a million times at the track and I have no doubt he will not cheat. He will do every little thing for advantage but he lives this shit and his performance is a result of his dedication to details that most don’t. One of the others on the stage right now will cheat like a mfkr. I know that because he has in the past.

IMO, the "Legion" is not an authority just a bunch of Demon owners who wanted to do their own thing (unless things have changed and they now allow non Demon owners). As Jack has pointed out, their rules leave much to be desired.

My interest is seeing if 8's can run be achieved running it stock. As many have pointed out, if it is modified it is just another modified car.

I was planning on racing mine completely stock but am having second thoughts because I will be racing at an disadvantage and I am too competitive for that not to bother me. .

 

[Speedy!]

In racing if you're not cheating you're not trying. Been that way since the days of NASCAR requiring roll cages and teams put in plastic pipe filled with extra fuel.

I think it unlikely these can run 8.90 stock. We won't know what Dodge did to the test cars to make them do it for 40 years.

 

[cole3986]

Draining windshield wiper fluid and/or removing reservoir
Removing windshield wipers and motor
Lightweight battery
Removing hardware from throughout the vehicle that would otherwise go unnoticed

The rules above don’t work, they assume that people will follow rules.
Weigh a 1 seat no option factory Demon 170 and set a weight requirement accordingly - also enforcing the rules above to keep the weight located largely where it was from the factory.

Jack,

Thanks for the post, I am so rusty that I forgot about all the shenanigans that go on when racing "stock".

 

[Jack_Toepfer]

IMO, the "Legion" is not an authority just a bunch of Demon owners who wanted to do their own thing (unless things have changed and they now allow non Demon owners). As Jack has pointed out, their rules leave much to be desired.

My interest is seeing if 8's can run be achieved running it stock. As many have pointed out, if it is modified it is just another modified car.

I was planning on racing mine completely stock but am having second thoughts because I will be racing at a disadvantage and I am too competitive for that not to bother me. .

Go run your 8 Cole… forget everyone else.

 

[Speedy!]

If there's gonna be some kind of stock competition then the minimum weight makes the most sense, but again I'm back to how much did the car that Dodge claims ran 8.91 weigh? That's the stuff we won't know for a long time. At some point there'll be a story done about these cars and they'll interview Jim Wilder and he'll spill the beans but we'll all be racing wheel chairs in the nursing home and can chuckle and say "I knew it".

 

[AlleyCat]

has anyone downloaded the tune to see how much timing these things run on e85 and above?

 

[drag racer]

I would love get my hands on a stock tune file from a 170

 

[AlleyCat]

My guess is about 22. It will leak out one of these days. Actually on second thought with the additional pressure in the cylinder it might be lower than I think. 20?

 

[DRAGRCR]

https://www.dodgegarage.com/news/ar...essions-of-an-srt-test-driver-part-three.html

 

[Demon Dan]

Did they have multiple slips or is that Timmy running his mouth again?

Maybe these will help.

 

[vortecd]

If there's gonna be some kind of stock competition then the minimum weight makes the most sense, but again I'm back to how much did the car that Dodge claims ran 8.91 weigh? That's the stuff we won't know for a long time. At some point there'll be a story done about these cars and they'll interview Jim Wilder and he'll spill the beans but we'll all be racing wheel chairs in the nursing home and can chuckle and say "I knew it".

There is a weight they know of for the 18's. Not sure why it would be so top secret to get it for the 170.

 

[vortecd]

Maybe these will help. View attachment 121808

What I have been seeing at my track is the MPH has been all over. Some days the mph at the 1/8th will higher in the right lane then the left or 1/4 will be higher in the other. I always try to run both lanes and analyze. The day I went 9.12 at 149 I was getting 151 in the other lane. I made 2 passes in right lane and went 119/151 mph but left lane was 120/149 mph. You sure would think if I went more mph in the 1/8th in one lane then it should have went more in the 1/4 but was the opposite. I always look at time and mph and try to come to the conclusion what make the most sense.

For the time the 170 is running and mph at the 1/8th there is a possibility the 1/4 mph is showing low. I would think this car should be picking up 30+ mph. Marc's time slip showing 122/155 mph for an 8.90 so 33 mph pick up. Very possibly the 170 actually ran 152-153 mph

This mph thing actually bothers me because it should always read the same. There have been times at my track where one lane is 4 mph higher then the other. When you can compare time slips for both lanes and they are the same increments all the way down but one is 4 mph higher you know one isn't right

All three time slips are the same lane so you can't compare the other lane to it. I need to look more into what could make the mph off. There are spots on the wall they line up the markers to so I don't know how they would be different unless the mph markers are different. Way back they used to tell you to "run it out the back door". That was because the mph markers were 66 feet before the 1/4 mile and 66 feet after the 1/4 where it was able to get an exact mph for the 1/4. They took out the after one so your mph is actually 33 feet before the finish line now because it is an average. I remember when they took them out and my mph on my 14 second car dropped 5 mph. Keep this in mind when looking at old time slips from the 70's. That car that went 13.9 at 105 would be closer 13.9 at 100 today

Found these to explain it

Previous to 1989, there were three timing lights at the end of the track; one AT the end of the quarter mile, and one 66 feet before, and one 66 feet after. The middle light was used to calculate the et of the run, and the time to travel the 132 feet at the end of the track was used to calculate the trap speed. This gave the average speed at the end of the track, but you can see what this lead to. Most of the racers stayed on the gas for an additional 66 feet past the quarter to get a consistent speed to evaluate their setup. The track's 'shut down area' of course is a fixed length, but the pro racers were starting to hit 300 mph plus by the end. In an attempt to get these guys off the gas 66 feet earlier and 'make' the cars appear slower, the NHRA stopped using the last light around August of 1989. Today, the trap speed is calculated between the light at the quarter mile and the one 66 feet before. So any timeslip after 1989 is really giving the average speed 33 feet from the finish, which is pretty close to one percent slower than before. The old constant of 230.5 became 228.4 to compensate.


MILES PER HOUR TIMER
Also known as the speed trap, this timer is located 66 feet before the finish line. It records the car’s average speed between it and the finish line. This is the mile per hour figure on your time slip.

 

[vortecd]

In racing if you're not cheating you're not trying. Been that way since the days of NASCAR requiring roll cages and teams put in plastic pipe filled with extra fuel.

I think it unlikely these can run 8.90 stock. We won't know what Dodge did to the test cars to make them do it for 40 years.

Never cared for that saying because there are many that don't cheat and put in the work to be the fastest. My combo in NMRA was as good as anybody's but was never properly tuned. It was a true street car which 99% were race cars. If I would have put it on a dyno session I would have been at the top. I found this out later when I did just do that and found a lot of power. My car was 100% legal. I had a combo that worked well together and I look back on a missed opportunity